Nude or Prude?
One thing I learned from living in Europe is that Europeans are much more comfortable with nudity than Americans. You see people in the buff on bus placards, magazines, daytime television, soft-core porn at night, the newspaper, and even at sporting events. What is even more striking is that you regularly see naked people in public parks—and older age or low fitness levels are not reasons to cover up or to be bashful at all. Even more interesting to me as an American who changed into her gym clothes in a stall to avoid showing any skin is the complete ease of being fully nude around family members and friends. I’ll never forget picking up a German friend’s family photo album and seeing her mom, dad, sisters, friends, and neighbors in a group shot with everything, and I mean everything, exposed. Even more shocking was to see my friend’s mom walk around their house without clothes on. Needless to say, I felt uncomfortable at first.
Many Europeans accept nudity as natural. Many Europeans also say that nudity and sex on television is totally okay. Sex is human. Bodies are ordinary—even naked ones. They do not understand Americans preoccupation of censoring all nudity on TV, while Americans allowing so much violence on television. (Child movie censors in Europe censor for violence, not nudity, while in the US, it is often the reverse. The movie “Chronicles of Narnia” in Germany is rated equivalent to the US’s PG13). The European illustration about TV censorship makes sense to me. Why DO we care so much about nudity? Why DO I feel bashful about being in the buff around others? Why wouldn’t I trust my friends and family to see me naked?
I think my shame of being nude stems from our culture. But why is it shameful to be nude in our culture? Why is it in some cases illegal to be nude in our culture? I’m tired of being prude. And I just decided that I will walk from the shower to my room in the morning without clothes or a towel on regardless of what the members of my household think.
Comment by Brandon on 6 December 2008 at 1:42 pm:
You’ve obviously never seen my mother’s husband in the buff. There are some things best left covered. Okay, joke aside, I’m going to cast my vote for puritan roots, Calvanism, belief that things of the flesh are sinful, etc.
Comment by Katie on 6 December 2008 at 1:58 pm:
Segen-
My experience in Spain was very similar. Nudity was totally accepted. At nighttime, every channel- cable or not- contained some sort of porn. Beaches were covered in naked bodies (mostly old, naked bodies). Newspaper stands sold palyboy-like magazines with full nudity on the covers.
The most interesting thing I saw was a television infomerical in Barcelona for a penis-elongation device (with demonstration). Yikes.
I think what was most surprising was my own reaction to the nudity- I barely noticed it. It was so natural there, so unapologetic, that people were barely conscious of it. In America, it seems like our lack of exposure (pun-intended) to sexual images makes us hyper-sensitive to them. I don’t think it’s necessarily better or worse, just kind of how it is.
Comment by John Bambenek on 7 December 2008 at 9:12 am:
Two quick comments…
First, modesty is not the same is prudity. Just because people don’t run around naked doesn’t make them frigid.
Second, you mention the difference in censorship between the US and Europe (namely censoring for nudity vs censoring for violence)… that did make me wonder something about Europe in both it’s sexual ethics and its defense policies. Namely, European countries (most of them at least) will cease to exist as societies in our lifetimes because they simply do not have children. They are going extinct and I think that speaks to something being wrong with their sexual values (not necessarily the flippancy with which they treat sex). From a defense perspective, they simply refuse to defend themselves. It’s not just gun bans… many of these countries its not unheard of for robbers to invade homes with the residents inside because they know even if they could defend themselves, it would be illegal to do so. Foreign policy is much the same… they think defense is diplomacy, which certainly has its place. Diplomacy without the ability or will to use force is simply empty words. That doesn’t necessarily justify imperialism, but the situation in Georgia is illustrative. Namely, Europe wanted to take no military action whatsoever, nor would permit anyone else (particularly Germany was most vocal) even though it was clearly an invasion that justified a military response. They are passive cultures that will be rolled once someone has the will to do so.
Comment by Brandon on 7 December 2008 at 10:20 am:
John,
“Many of these countries its not unheard of for robbers to invade homes with the residents inside”
You silly sot. That happens here all the time too. http://www.gothamgazette.com/article/crime/20050201/4/1313
“the situation in Georgia is illustrative. Namely, Europe wanted to take no military action whatsoever, nor would permit anyone else (particularly Germany was most vocal) even though it was clearly an invasion that justified a military response”
Actually, there’s pretty conflicting reports on it. If the accounts that Georgia provoked the attacks are accurate, then it’s not per se unreasonable to not want to take sides in a mutual armed conflict, disproportionate though it may be.
Comment by John Bambenek on 7 December 2008 at 1:46 pm:
You’re comparing drug dealers and gang leaders raiding homes of addicts or other dealers to what goes on in Europe? Really? I think we can all see a difference between gang violence and raiding the homes of innocent people…
Brandon, whatever conflicting reports you think may still exist have long since been debunked as steaming piles of crap… Russia had already massed troops at the border long before the festivities started, and more importantly, it’s all indisputably Georgian territory. It’s like Canada invading the US because Kentucky activated the national guard.
Comment by Brandon on 7 December 2008 at 6:15 pm:
Home invasion: No, it’s just that reliable statistics are hard to come by. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home_invasion . If someone is audacious enough to try a home invasion, they won’t care whether you might have a gun because in all likelihood they’ll have cased your house and will know how many people are home and you won’t have the chance to reach it unless it’s tucked in your belt all day. Home invasion isn’t unheard of here man. My mom’s place in East LA had a heavy security door with metal grating and hinges on the inside for a reason. If you’re worried about robbery, get a dog, not a gun.
Georgia: Sure Russia was probably looking for an excuse, but the question is who fired the first shots, Georgia or the South Ossetian separatists. This is a little more like the French attacking the British because the American colonies rebelled than Kentucky activating its national guard. It’s a foreign nation supporting a rebellion/insurgency. Whatever your opinion on the insurgency is, this is nothing like Kentucky activating its national guard unless that national guard were going to attack the breakaway city of Louisville that had strong ties with Canada.
Comment by Joshua on 7 December 2008 at 7:39 pm:
I feel like this is just about to get good…
Comment by Segen on 8 December 2008 at 12:49 am:
john…what is this?
http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2008/12/07/world/20081207-GREECE_index.html
Comment by Todd on 8 December 2008 at 2:10 pm:
John,
I suspect that the direction of causality is mostly (lots of factors – economic, cultural, practical, and more) -> low desire to have children -> more casual attitude toward sex rather than more casual attitude -> low desire to have children.
My reasons for this are:
1. As someone who has no desire to have children and a very casual attitude toward sex, this direction of causality matches what I’ve personally experienced.
2. Sub-replacement fertility levels exist in the vast majority of wealthy nations – Europe, yes, but also Japan, South Korea, Australia, and Canada. The US is one of the few exceptions. Sexual attitudes vary a lot from nation to nation.
Comment by Brandon on 8 December 2008 at 3:03 pm:
The US only has replacement + presently thanks to immigrants. The white population is falling and will continue to do so.
Comment by Benevolent Dictator on 12 December 2008 at 3:04 pm:
Part of the problem is who is reproducing in a socio-economic sense. The most successful, most educated people are the least fecund while the least educated are most fertile. All of this raises questions about the need for social services, especially the need to improve public education in the United States. However, I do not believe that increasing nudity in the US will increase the population of the higher educated nor will in decrease the population of the less educated. There is no coincidence that the highest rate of marriage and divorce is in Ala or Miss (one of the two) which is also one of the most religious states. Read Hellfire Nation, the History of Sin in America by James Morone which discusses how the Neo-Puritans have influenced public policy in the U.S.
Comment by Jill Bains on 14 December 2008 at 12:36 am:
“In America, sex is everywhere but in sex.” –(Roland Barthes)
Comment by John Bambenek on 15 December 2008 at 3:21 pm:
I’m particularlÝ tickled by being lectured about “facts” and “research” by someone who is citing wikipedia… Just wow.